Proverbs 13:24: (NASB) He who withholds his rod hates his son, but he who loves him disciplines him diligently.
Children are people too! Yes they are, but what does that really mean in terms of raising them? After all, they are children, and the object is for them to become adults – real, full-fledged, mature, contributory adults! As a parent, is it our responsibility to walk them to that destination or do they instinctively know how to get there on their own? Could it be that parents are just in the way? What does the Bible say? Is the Bible right for our generation? Stay with us!
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Chris. I certainly agree that all shunning is wrong especially if it involves families with children, many ex witnesses feel bitter about this process and I agree. False teachers within the congregation need.removal from the congregation with a ban on being teachers in the future. Your method of a congregation vote sounds good idea. The elder arrangement within JWs has gone too far especially with the involvement in judicial committees and the expelling process with shunning.
A word to upset witnesses ; Jehovah will bring to judgement those who have attacked their brothers in this way. Please keep serving Jehovah.
Concerning the two hopes Jesus clearly mentioned both the ‘meek’ and in his Reverlation to John the ‘great crowd come out of great tribulation’ also mentioned in Mth 24:21 no flesh would be saved. ‘Flesh’ survivors human as in days of Noah.
Brother Russel only focused on heavenly hope because at that time 144 yrs ago that was the priority sealing the bride class. As time passed by late 1920 it was obvious that there was an earthly group, and many realised they were not to be kings and priests.
The heavenly group is not superior they serve the earthly group there job is in government over earth. You cannot have earthly things in heaven, there is no gardening, climbing, travelling, cooking, eating delicious food, these are earthly activities. Activities of humans on earth.Some actually want human activity so much they believe those in heaven will put on fleshly bodies, Mad. I think it all comes down to the lie Satan chanted in Eden that God planned sin and Adam was meant to fall.
This is cruel slander Jehovah’s plan was for humans from Adam and Eve to fill the earth with perfect happy heathy people living forever on earth. Satans lie that humans were planned to die and then live on in heaven if they are good is the greatest lie ever told. ( a belief that is in Islam as well, they also believe in a transgendered God).
Must go x
Gasa,
I completely understand. I can see where you’re having trouble. Usually when Bible students say that we believe that the great company is in heaven they generally think that we mean that no one is going to live on the earth. When I talk to JWson the street and we say that the Great Company class is in heaven they are quick to say “Then why did he he say that man was created in the earth?” When we say that the great company class is heavenly we don’t mean that no one will live on the earth. We believe that if one is called to the 144,000 and doesn’t make it they don’t fall back to the earthly hope. They will be of the great crowd before the throne.No first-century Christian believed they were going to live on the earth. They were called to run for the heavenly prize. That’s why when talking to JWs they are quick to show me passages from Isaiah, and Psalms for an earthly hope. Jesus came to Israel and offered them the opportunity to reign in heaven first. Now that call is being extended to the gentiles. Never do we see observers in a memorial or anyone discussing the earthly hope as a Christian. This is why the Watchtower correctly says that the New Testament if for the anointed mainly because all its promises to Jesus followers are heavenly.
I disagree. The heavenly group is superior to the earthly group. They aren’t just a government over them. They are promised the DIVINE NATURE!! They will be joint-heirs with Christ and gain the same nature as God.
2 Peter 1:4
Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be PARTAKERS OF THE DIVINE NATURE, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
Yes the focus was the sealing of the bride. And it still is. Once that bride is complete then they will be brought to heaven and the great company class and they will resurrect the entire world of mankind. Rutherford changed this because his group had more than 144,000 consecrating since 1874. He had to have a place to put them and came up with Jonadab class.
Have you ever read the book “Crisis of Conscience”? The new edition has a pamphlet that was circulated in the 1980’s which caused many JWs to leave and it goes into why the great crowd is in heaven.
What it is boiling down to is the Bible Students ministry was the “first witness” to be deposed in 1918, and had the board taken over like they tried in 1917, 1918 would not have become necessary.
The FIRST attempt was 1897, then the Russell ASSISINATION on Halloween 1916, NO WAY was that death not a Rev6:9-11 kill shot. Do NOT be fooled, they KILLED both Russell and Ruherford (Rutherford and Knorr with radiation isotopic exposure) and they killed Fred Franz too, December 21st (they just said Dec22 to throw us off a little) the two most important Satanic holidays are Dec21-25 with Oct31.
NO ACCIDENT Jacqueline!
And now they completed mission in GB-1976 to really complete the anti-JW org based ministry op in the near future and you can watch it all right on CNN as Daniel8:13-14 starts.
Jehovah’s witnesses will be recovered BUT full disclosure is required and peace with Bible Students of the “first witnessing” for they will form one whole final warning epicenter of God Volcanic good news completion of Rev10:5-11 to Rev11:1-7.
JW ministry will be ceased the final time in Rev11:7 after the 1260 days final warning and open salvation initial offer is complete.
JWs have much to disclose, they have to expose and condemn the GB, EXONERATE Ray Franz, make peace with Bible Students and so on. The GB debacles began in that 1971-1981 coup period, the axed Ray Franz not because of 1914 stuff, that was just the pretext, they did it to MAKE SURE Frad Franz could not “pass the torch” to Ray to expose KN UN 3.0, 1990, as Daniel 11:30-31.
There are a couple other reasons, but I will leave that full disclosure for the preparation into the final warning of the future.
All this controversy is for a good reason, it will get tons of global attention when it is most important to focus on this JW centered disaster coming, the “enemy” is IN their house, running and ruining the place, but not for long, the “1/2 hour” of not hearing a word on this matter from a “silent Heaven” is ending and when it does JW org will explode in Heaven’s first statement to end that half hour of symbolic “silence” ont he Devil GB and all this JW UN NGO and pedophile garbage governed by that Dan11:32a GB viper pit from the Devil’s own “seed”.
Jehovah’s Witnesses Child Abuse and the Australian Royal Commission promotion
The PROBLEM with Bethel now, is the 20/20 likes of exposure are now ratcheded up a notch. See, Stone Phillips can’t throw you in prison or fine you 20 billion dollars, but the Queen can.
And that is what a Royal Commission is a little summary for the “small horn” Queen of the Anglo empire. But she is not alone, the “Great Father” in Washington also has caught wind of the stench of dead children now wafting forth from the Bethell floorboards.
THE PROBLEM with Bethel is the “superior authorities” now SEE the root of the evil. Not JWs, but they are going to be affected greatly, but the so-called “Governing Body”. That child sacrificing coven of warlocks called the “Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses” is who are now denying, under oath mind you, they are even “God’s mouthpiece” or that they even “listen to the Watchtower” s they sit as the private corporate system “Supreme Court Justices” who fell their manmade laws can now override Caesar whom they school in court proceedings, as they cloak it all under cover of the Bible which exposes them as the criminal cabal they are.
THE BIGPROBLEM IS, Caesar does not like “judges” telling people what to do, for Caesar knows it is his own job as per Romans 13, so they KNOW (Isa36:10) JWs are actually in transgression against God.
And that is good to know, like Assyria,or Babylon or Rome, once the enemy knows JWs are given to a judgment, they pursue it with zeal until it is accomplished as history plainly attests to that fact, over, and over, and over again.
BETHELL’S PROBLEM is trying to be a private legal system, which is against the law,it is a church mafia is what it is, with all the death, threats, and skims that go with the mob, or the GB Godfathers.
And now, as usual, God is lifting some rafters to reveal dead children’s bones, God is opening the Bethel closet as sheep bones come rattling forth on the floor for ALL, but JWs, to see. So, JWs, like Jews in Matthew 24:15 “apostate this generation” are now aiding CRIMINALS:
(1 Peter 4:15-17) . . .However, let none of YOU suffer as a murderer or a thief or an evildoer or as a busybody in other people’s matters [like the GB, or as a child molester or money laundering con]. 16 But if [he suffers] as a Christian, let him not feel shame, but let him keep on glorifying God in this name. 17 For it is the appointed time for the judgment to start with the house of God. Now if it starts first with us…
So, much suffering is gearing up to be Isa28 poured like a global flashflood tsunami on JWs, with big bad global events to lead to world war, but JWs will in reality not be “suffering as Christians”, nope, Bethell has assured JWs they will be sufferign as accomplices to criminal activity led by the GB based corporate Supreme Court of JW “united nations”.
It will be Daniel 8:13-14, and it is a timed prophecy of 3.19 years of sheer hell on JWs,for all who doubt now, it will prove itself later with that timing and its anti-JW-whorg events.
THEN, minus 50 billion, minus a KH, minus the JW org, JWs will have to stand up and face the reality of this dreadfully catastrophic situation that has been nurtured and enginnered by that fraud Governign Body, since especially 1976.
The GB Experiment is a fail. (Dan11:32a; Zech3:1-3)
Chuck Russell, you seem to know a lot of very true facts about the governing body of Jehovah witnesses.
I like the fact you put it exactly on the shoulders of that body as in defiance of God and Christ. The rank and file as associates will be affected as you say by the taking down of that whole system of rulership by a religious body. All these ruling bodies are in opposition to God.
Thanks for such a clear expository of that body.
It is very hard to make this too simple, pardon the length, but JW org going down will be its seal that is ALL true. Of course Jacqueline, PROPHECY OF GOD has all the details and clues and timings and events we need to look for and know; And this time there is a very good reason why this has to come out BEFORE it all happens, just like Russell did prior to WW1 and all the events it spawned in world government political, military and financial foundations.
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Search “1944 Governing Body Birthday” and “Governing Body Daniel 8:13 Wrong Condition” because the blasphemy and its ties to Zech3:1 Satan at the “right hand” of Joshua is 1000 times worse than can be barely outlined in a post or article. The GB is worse than bad news, they are as good as Satan leading JWs, the same entity is involved for a reason. (2Thess2:9)
The point being in regard to Daniel 8:13-14 which has NOT fulfilled yet, for it is the final temple judgment cycle marker, is WTBTS have been applying the “right condition” since 1944 to themselves! BLASPHEMY of 2Thess2:1-4.
Now the convenient thing as noted in those articles is that they are also TYING themselves and this UN NGO APOSTASY marker to the Daniel 8:13-14 prophecy that will INSTEAD, fulfill in the future on them removed (zech3:5; Isa66:6) and exposed, and it is the same one they have been applying to themselves since 1958 and made complete in their 1999 Daniel commentary “Pay [ZERO] Attention to Daniel’s Prophecy” book of errors.
The key JW stalling errors of today are in Dan8 and 11 as far as stalling the news of what world government completion will trigger in Christ arrival. (And forcing JWs to buy the USSR-to-Russia DECOY continuation as “King North” a critical error in IDing world government development since 1990 3rd UN event; They do this to mislead and bewilder JWs as the org is going down by enemy planning, aiding internally by the GB fraud control center; (Dan11:32a, from the real King North, hence why they keep the real KN secret by the USSR error)
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Now as you may be aware, Daniel 8:11-14 is a very very very BACK BURNER low profile teaching among JWs, most of them have no clue how to try to explain it and few even know about it.
But it is very important because it gives a “man of lawlessness” paper trail in JW public record since 1944 of how they injected in the Babel based “Governing Body” idea, first even mentioned among JW in 1944. Then they developed the idea of “Theocratic Organization” to be ruled by a GB Tyranny, BUT they never explicitly connected the two for JWs to SEE what was going on.
But in the JW org, that so-called “theocracy” a fraud to depose JWs in the long run by GB Pied Piper “gradually given over” subversion and control (Dan8:12) and the “Governing Body” development are what control Bethel at the top, and all the congregations and now they outright OWN ALL the KH’s, and control the whole thing for actually the Daniel 11:32a purpose. (hence Matthew24:15 warning to flee UN-NGO-JW org NOW!!!)
So, it is no accident these men from Satan are now JW leaders “in the temple” for a PUBLICLY LIFTED UP signal (2Thess2:3-4), and that they apply the prophecy to come in Daniel 8:13-14 in the future vents an timing of the temple judgment, to themselves as if “right condition” truthful, pure and holy. They are in reality “evil slave” MOL and the architects of the Zech3:3 “befouled garments” of criminal and blood guilty reproaches and lawless activity reflecting on God and Christ “Joshua” in Zech3.
This kind of blasphemous claims and connection in JW history and writings will make certain they are exposed as the real Daniel 8:11-14 prophecy becomes explained as chapter 1 of the final warning it must lead to, the “second witnessing” cycle, 1260 days, of the two witnesses which is also “seven times” but as 2520 DAYS which BEGAN, as the 2520 years “seven times” ended in 1914.
Thus it also ties back to Russell’s primary reference point for today, it set the main benchmark of all the world-government-vs-Messianic-Kingdom continuums of Dan7,8,11-12, Rev13, 17.
And this is all no accident, now JW org will go down, and it is “2300 evenings and mornings” timed and “the evening” and “the morning” phased lest some should doubt now. In that timing, there will be no reason to doubt when judgment comes on the “befouled” “wrong condition” JW org
Then developments the 20 million people tracking this hypocrisy and JW global lawlessness center and being affected know now, will by all this culmination of Daniel 8:13 become known to THREE BILLION PEOPLE globally and more, because the JW org implosion “trampling” of Daniel 8:13 WILL GARNER THE PROPER GLOBAL ATTENTION for God to then manifest the final warning from the smoke of that judgment. (Rev9)
Dan8:13 includes a 3.19 year minimum desolation requirement “the evening” phase (Dan8:26) which will become visible and global news on the JW org GLOBAL downfall; they are NOW selling this to JWs as “the end” as per WT11/15/13 and WT7/15/15, and that is 2Thess2:1-2 premature “the end” and Christa arrival DELUSION from MOL (man of lawlessnes) among JWs from the “lawless one” who will use that “end” scare to herd as many JWs as they can to FEMA and other global detention centers in the crash, then cancel the JW ministry and try to abort the final warning by decimating the JW resource “established place” of Daniel 8:11 (Nahum2).
But it will NOT be that “the end”, it is the world war “sword stroke” of Rev13:3 that “heals” into 8th King world government, but it is delayed as per Isa38 and that gives enough time for the final warning to manifest fully from the recovery “morning” of Daniel 8:14 (Rev9 parallel point) which GOD recovers into “temple cleansed” “right condition” to allow the final commission of Rev10:5-11 to then deploy as the final “second witnessing” 1260 days prior to world government and the Christ arrival it must trigger, but by then in fully updated and forewarned open salvation offer manner completely. (Dan7:25, Dan12:7, Rev11:2-3; Rev12:14; Rev13:5-7; Rev11:7-10)
All those final 1260 day cycle time signatures parallel to the 1290 days Daniel 12:11 (Dan7:26) activation in which post 1260 days complete time, that Rev11:8-10 “3.5 days death state” final elapsed symbolic timing elapsing, it merges into the Christ arrival of Rev11:11-12, Rev16:17-20, Rev14 incept. (and others like Matt24:29-31; Rev19:11+, Rev1:7)
This time it all has to come out years in advance and fully summarized as per Rev10:5-7, BEFORE it happens*** so, you know, people can make use of the warning and that final open salvation offer amidst huge global proof that world government completion will cease that final warning (Rev11:7-10; Rev13:5-7) AFTER it completes it 1260 days, and it shall trigger the Mighty Christ in person for the Global Sheep-Sweep and the final conquest just as it shall warn of for the whole preceding prophecy gauged periods, and in a way to involve all Christians who can understand the import finality of that final portion of the “little scroll”. (“side two” of the Rev5:1 seven sealed scroll, in other words)
(Revelation 10:11) And they say to me: “You must prophesy AGAIN with regard to peoples and nations and tongues and many kings.”
But it ties it all from Russell forward (as far as those prophecies for post 1914 significance), all together in a unique open manner with a positive open salvation message main requirement.
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Isa 48:6-7, 48:18-19, Isa42:9
(Isaiah 48:6-7) You have heard. Behold it all. As for you people, will you not tell [it]? I have made you hear new things from the present time, even things kept in reserve, that you have not known. 7 At the present time they must be created, and not from that time, even things that before today you have not heard, that you may not say, ‘Look! I have already known them.’
(Isaiah 42:9) . . .“The first things—here they have come, but new things I am telling out. Before they begin to spring up, I cause you people to hear [them].”
(Isaiah 43:18-19) 18 “Do not remember the first things (1914-1919), and to the former things do not turn your consideration. 19 Look! I am doing something new. Now it will spring up. you people will know it, will you not?