Born in a Stable and He Saved the World

Phil 2:7 “He emptied himself, taking the form of a bondservant and being made in the likeness of men.”

For a very confused world Christmas is here!  For them it is the time for celebration of Santa, elves, reindeer, mistletoe, snow, decoration, gifts, parties, football, TV holiday specials, Christmas songs, holiday cheer, holly, mistletoe, shopping, spending money.

Even though not the real date of Jesus’ birth, such a blessing can be enjoyed by people who view it instead as a time for deep heartfelt thankfulness, when we give honor to the most important, courageous, loving, wise and humble man to have ever lived; the man Christ Jesus, our Savior and Lord.

Listen to a spiritual, worshipful and respectful view of the message of Jesus birth from the Bible Students Christian Questions Radio program.   Simply click here to enjoy.

30 comments to Born in a Stable and He Saved the World

  • Domenic Pappalardo

    Question 4) “Was he(Jesus) a sacrifice? or is there more to his death?”

    Peters reply: / ransom / anitlutron/ corresponding price

    I agree with peters reply. Jesus death had to have a corresponding price. One life in exchange for the whole human family is not a corresponding price. Within the few days of Jesus death, (medical fact) Jesus seed died. That unborn perfect human seed would have been a perfect human race. That unborn race for this one, was a corresponding exchange.

    • Jacqueline

      Domenic I believe that Adam was that correspondence, fitting exactly the man Jesus. Inside of Jesus was many seed of course but they were perfect. Jesus ransomed Adam and thus Eve and everyone coming out of him are ransomed. Jehovah knew of his plan that is probably why he didn’t condemn Adam to everlasting death, just “dust tho art and to dust tho shall return”. He can’t lie Adam went back to dust only and those dying as and in Adam are ransomed. This seed of Eve was Jesus.(Gen.3:15) Jehovah said “He” would crush Satan. Jesus said at John 8:44, “you are from your “Father” the devil”. They said no we are Abraham’s children. And they dealt him a crushing blow this seed of the Devil by having him impaled as a common criminal in the harshes way on a crux. Perhaps Eve at Gen 4:1 thought Cain was that seed, again running ahead of God’s plan as she did by touching the fruit. So here I see both seeds standing together even as Jesus was on earth.Just another way of looking at it by a common person, which I am. I can’t seem to understand the original languages and this might be by God’s grace. For there are many that are simple and can still understand the Bible. Thank you Jacqueline

      • Domenic Pappalardo

        Jacqueline,
        A ransom is a payment which must be paid. correspondence means it has to be an equal payment. Jesus being the second Adam only means he was perfect, as Adam was when he was created.
        An equal payment for the human race, had to be a perfect human race. Jesus had within him, a perfect human race. Do you not make the connection? Jesus bought our race with the unborn human race within him. Adam has nothing to do with it. As to Adam being given a second chance at life…he died from a judgment from God. Those who die such, will not be given life again.

        • Jacqueline

          Domenic because I see nowhere in the bible the concept of seed within Adam as being the ransom, I accept this as your opinion only. You ask if I get the connection? I understand perfectly what you are saying it is not difficult. I just don’t accept it as factual from the bible. I respect your right to think and fire up the neurons and synaps. This is a privilege to be able to speak to one another without fear of being branded an apostate, also to say I disagree and we still be friends. Also I might note to be a female and speak, being of the body of Christ hopefully, is a privilege I wouldn’t have enjoyed as a witness. So this is a blessing all around.

      • Domenic Pappalardo

        Jacqueline, You are correct…we all believe what we believe.
        It seems to me some of the teaching of the BS’s are thus;
        1)Take every scripture as it reads.
        2) follow Russell.
        3) All will be saved.

        I for one can not follow any of those three statements.
        To teach people that all will be saved…is not true. There are many scriptures against that. Here is just one;

        Zec “14:12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

        If all are saved, who are these? And I’m sure there are many others in the grave with the same nature.

        • Jacqueline

          Domenic, where in Zechariah does it say this is judgement day for those. Resurrection will allow these ones to repent and acknowledge their wrong. Ransom for All. Deaths far worse than this and for far worse things like pedophilia has occurred but that does not water down Jesus sacrifice. In fact you were the first to say sin is sin. In battle many will die. Also notice Rev says the sword come from his mouth. HE Speaks the word and it shall be done! And when they come back in JUDGEMENT DAY which is 1,000 yr reign they may repent and live.
          You say BS believe. I told you what Jacqueline believe. Coming from a JW background you seem to still be under the unity of thought to move as an army of one. Jesus disciples had questions and a brain that he stimulated.
          You confuse “FREEDDOM AND LIBERTY IN CHRIST” with disunity. I understand where you come from. Corporations must insist on everyone agreeing to survive. But Paul. Peter and the different apostles went out to different parts of the world to preach and didn’t consult as Paul stated with men. The Holy Spirit of God keeps us unified. I am amazed how we meet in Christian love at convention and etc and without a “Mother” organization the brothers love each other.
          You set not being different, as the criteria for being a Christian. Jesus set that they have love among themselves and by their fruit you will know them as the criteria.
          Who are we to follow you or Christ in this regard? We both will agree it is simple, not hard to dwell in unity in Christ as the touchstone.
          In association with the BS I have learned to let each have a thought on how they see a point of scripture. You seem to think we must agree with your thoughts. State it and leave it Domenic, there is nothing wrong with saying something and not having everybody agree with you. Move on to some other good points that you have pondered. I have learned thru my association not to beat the horse to death.
          And remember BS all have minds so don’t try to force any into the same now everybody turn left, now right, now march mind mode. We are not an organization but we are UNIFIED IN LOVE for one another.

    • Peter K. (admin)

      Domenic – Thanks. Ransom (Greek “anti-lutron”) has the thought is an exact equivalent, a corresponding price.

      The reason everyone is born in sin and dies is because of Adam. Rom 5:12 says, “…just as through one man sin entered into the world and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men because they had all sinned-.” (NWT). When Adam disobeyed, he lost his right to live and he lost his family’s right to live.

      Under Moses’ Law, justice demanded “a life for a life.” This was God’s perfect law. If a man killed someone, he must pay with his own life: a life for a life. (Exodus 21:23-25; Deuteronomy 19:21). Jehovah solved the problem by satisfying justice with the Ransom price of Jesus perfect human life paid for Adam’s lost perfect human life.

      The Apostle Paul uses the Greek word anti-lutron, signifying, “a corresponding price,” saying, “The man, Christ Jesus, gave himself a ransom [anti-lutron—corresponding price] for all, to be testified in due time.” 1 Tim. 2:6. The Greek word lutroo is rendered “redeemed.” Prof. Young defines lutroo to signify “to loose by a price”—that is, to set free by the payment of a price. The basis or root of this word is lutron, which, as noted above with anti, used either as a prefix or a suffix, signifies a corresponding price.

      Put in simple terms, Ransom means that something was lost and that you have to pay something of equal value to get it back.

      Salvation comes by substitutionary atonement. One man, Jesus Christ, died for one man, Adam, so that Adam and all his posterity might live. The Apostle Paul outlines this concept of substitutionary atonement in two passages:

      “For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.” Corinthians 15:21, 22

      “But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.” Rom. 5:15

      Since the first man, Adam, was a perfect human being, it follows that Jesus, as a corresponding price, must also be a perfect human being and that the resultant life for Adam’s posterity must be perfect human life.

      As Adam, through disobedience, forfeited his life, so Jesus, by his death, as a corresponding price, paid a full and exact offset for Father Adam’s life, and in consequence for all Adam’s posterity—every human soul—sharers in his fall and in his loss. With Adam redeemed, all his posterity are entitled to a resurrection from the dead to human perfection and a trial for life under the favorable conditions of Paradise Earth.

      • Domenic Pappalardo

        I agree with your post Peter. As you believe, is how I believed for many years. Using the Bible, and backing scripture up to scripture, it can be proven, Cain was not Adams son. This changes why we die. It would also change what was given to save the human family.
        Allow me to give you something else I found in my search;
        If Cain was from an angel/animal creature, things of this creature would have passed on to Cain, and over time the human family. Today there are many humans who are homosexual…did you know there are many (all types) animals who are homosexual?
        Peter, I did not read a few things, and then decide Eve had sex with Satan. I spent many years trying to prove, and disprove what I had found.
        I do not expect Christians to accept this. It is to far from our Bible training. But it is a fact, and Satan does not want it known.

        Read about the animals here:
        Homosexual behavior in animals – Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
        en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexual_behavior_in_animals Cached
        Applying the term…|
        Research|
        Physiological…|
        Genetic basis
        When describing animals, the term homosexual is preferred over gay, … No species has been found in which homosexual behaviour has not been shown to exist, …

  • hank

    I am just trying to reason with the audience. Believe you, or read how Jesus and the writers of the Christian Greek Scriptures disagree with you beliefs and stories.

    Nothing personal, but peoples everlasting lives are at stake, and fables will lead to everlasting destruction. It is serious.

    • Domenic Pappalardo

      Hank,Thank you for your concern. You believe I am leading people off into destruction, and you are trying to save them from my evil ways…is that correct?

  • hank

    Are you saying Jesus didn’t know what he was saying at Mt. 20:28? “to give his own life a ransom for the many.”

    #8 1 Cor. 15:36,”You unreasonable person! What you sow is not made alive unless first it dies.”

    Heb. 9:28, “Christ was offered once for all time to bear the sins of many.”

    I doubt that sit down with Peter will ever take place.

  • hank

    Are you saying Jesus didn’t know what he was saying at Mt. 20:28? “to give his own life a ransom for the many.”

  • hank

    Please————–2 Peter 1:16, “It was not by way of cleverly concocted myths that we taught you about the coming in power of our Lord Jesus Christ.”

    Another inspired Bible writer agrees with Peter by saying, “They will stop listening to the truth and will wander off to fables.” 2 Tim 4:4

    Does it make you happy to have that power, or gift?

  • hank

    To Peter;

    “where he did?” Number 8 had two questions and this helps showing why he died where he did.

    Gen. 22:2, “Then he said: “Take, please, your son, your only son whom you love, Isaac, and travel to the land of Moriah and offer him up there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains that I will designate to you.”

    Where? “land of Moriah”

    2 Chronicles 3:1, “Then Solomon started to build the house of Jehovah in Jerusalem on Mount Moriah, where Jehovah had appeared to his father David, in the place that David had prepared on the threshing floor of Ornan the Jebusite.

    1 Chronicles 21:21, “David said to Ornan: “Sell me the site of the threshing floor, so that I may build an altar to Jehovah on it.”
    2 Samuel 24:18, “So Gad came into David on that day and said to him: “Go up, set up for Jehovah an altar on the threshing floor of Araunah the Jesubite.”

    John 19:20, “because the place where Jesus was nailed to the stake was near the city.”

    What are the chances? What are the odds? Could these things evolve out this way?
    1.Jehovah God’s only begotten-son sacrificed on Mount Moriah. But about 2,000 years earlier A writing of Abraham to offer his only son as a sacrifice on Mount Moriah.

    2.In between those 2,000 years several things have to take place, in order to have it take place. Abraham dies and about 400 years later this group of his descendants are freed from Egypt. This story is amazing in itself. Then the conquering of the land, and up and downs the people had during the period of Judges. Then the Kingly line, and keep in mind this one who would be the great sacrifice would come through Abraham’s line.

    3. Then David has that altar built there. Now, for you computer geeks, you may want to research the dome of the rock or there a bouts. Look for stone alter discovered under the dome with high tech what ever they use.

    4. Then 14 or 15 hundred years after Abraham while in captivity in Babylon, God has Daniel give a prophecy as to when he would show up, what would happen, and then what would happen to that city again.

    Now granted we have many who believe in conspiracies. But it would be humanly impossible to pull off all those things.

    So now after Peter answered all those questions, one must ask. Do I want to serve Jehovah God who sent his Son to die so I might have a chance to live?

  • Domenic Pappalardo

    Bob is correct, Jesus was born in a stable.
    Since 1999 I have been writing the Bible into fiction form. All events, and people as recorded in the Bible. I have added fiction to the characters in order to bring them to life. Below is the birth of Jesus as I see it from my story, “Clay of the Gods.”

    Bethlehem was a city in chaos, for Rome had ordered a census. The new Roman Procurator Coponius, ordered all the people in the district to report and be counted. Not since King David had such an order been given to the people. Many believed this new census; like the last, would cause a plague. Large groups were raising up against the Romans. Joseph and his wife Mary who was with child had traveled many miles to register. Joseph led his two donkeys through the outskirts of Bethlehem, seeking safe lodging for he and his wife. Mary rode upon Jasper the truer footed of the two beasts.
    ”Why must we go so far from the center of the city?” she demanded. “What was wrong with the last place? can’t you see I am tired?”
    Joseph shook his head but said nothing, he too was tired.
    “Please,” she begged in her child like voice, “I must rest.”
    “The man said there was a safe place on the edge of town,” replied Joseph. “It is away
    from the danger.”
    The stone road became a dirt trail. The buildings in this part of Bethlehem were nothing more than mud huts. The dirt trail came to an end, leaving Joseph nothing to look upon but an open field.
    “There is a house over there,” he pointed.
    “Oh Joseph, why do you always have to do this? can’t you ever listen to what I have to say? do you always have to be the boss?”
    Joseph put his head down in defeat. “I am the man. I am the head. It is my duty as your husband to take care of you.”
    “You’re not doing a very good job. I want to go home,” she cried, “I want to go home.”
    Joseph put his arms around her and kissed her hair. “I am sorry my love, I will try to do better for you, I promise.”
    Clay of the Gods/Domenic/Chapter sixteen/Mary Page 95
    Joseph circled the little house twice, knocking on the walls and shutters. He could hear grunts and sounds of those sleeping, but they gave no reply to his distress.
    “They are all sound asleep,” he said picking the hairs from his nose. “We will bed in that open barn until morning, then perhaps they can help us.”
    “Joseph,” she said, drawing in a deep breath. “I think it is time.
    “Time? What do you mean it is time? What are you going to do?
    “Help me down Joseph,” she said in a whisper.
    “Mary, you can’t do this now. Can’t you wait until morning?”
    “Oh my poor darling,” she smiled, “you are worse off than I.”
    Joseph helped her from the donkey. Her frail body tremble in his hands.
    “Wait here,” he shouted, “I will get help.”
    “Joseph, don’t leave me.”
    “God is with you,” he shouted racing for the little house.
    “I don’t need God,” she cried, “I need you Joseph.”
    She could feel the child within her move. Warm liquid ran down her legs.
    “Oh Joseph,” she whispered with alarm., “wait, please wait.” Holding her stomach she slowly limped toward the open barn. The smell of sheep dung surrounded her senses, and she became sick. Slowly with one hand she lowered herself to her knees and spread her blue robe before her, letting her long hair fall from her hood.
    “Joseph,” she pleaded, “were are you?”
    The pains became rapid. She rolled onto her back for relief. The pain increased. She began to drift in and out of darkness. A hand touched her forehead, she smiled, “Joseph,” she whispered. Her vision cleared. “Who are you?” she shouted at the dirty face before her.
    Clay of the Gods/Domenic/Chapter sixteen/Mary Page 96
    “He is a Sheppard,” smiled Joseph over the mans shoulder, “he can help.”
    “It can’t be any different,” grinned the man, “than giving berth to a lamb.”
    Mary could see yellow stains of the mans broken teeth.
    ”This is not what I had in mind for this birth Joseph, I wanted this to be special.”
    The shepherd hung his oil lamp above Mary, giving a warm glow to the open barn.
    Joseph knelt beside her and whispered, “What is he going to do?”
    “I don’t know,” replied Mary, “he’s just standing there.”
    “I mean God,” said Joseph, “what is he going to do?”
    “I don’t care what he does,” screamed Mary, digging her nails deep into Josephs arm, “its coming, and it hurts.”
    “Do something,” demanded Joseph of the shepherd.
    He bent over her, scratching the stubble on his face. “She has to do most of it. What do you want me to do?” he said shrugging his shoulders.
    A mild wind began to wisp across the open field, gently lifting flakes of straw about the open barn. Joseph took Mary’s hands and held them tightly. He bent and kissed her moist forehead. She drew a deep breath, arched her back and screamed into the darkness. Lighting thundered across a clear night sky, strange lights darted from horizon to horizon. The cry of a new born male brought relief to Josephs breathing. “I was afraid it would be a girl,” he whispered.
    Mary smiled his name, “Jesus.”

  • Domenic Pappalardo

    Why Jesus came to earth as a human;
    Religious Christian leaders teach, “Jesus came to die for our sins.” Is this a true Bible teaching? If we take this teaching apart, what will we find? Below are 14 simple questions that deal with this teaching.

    1) Was Jesus a perfect man without sin?
    2) If he had not been murdered, would he have never died?
    3) Did Jesus came to die to free us from our sins?
    4) Was he a sacrifice? or is there more to his death?
    5) Jesus is said to have been dead for three days…was he?
    6) Why did the Romans thrust a spear into him, and not the other two men with him?
    7) Could Jesus have had children?
    8) Why did Jesus come to die when he did, and where he did?
    9) Is this the seed God spoke of in Genesis 3:15?
    10) Who is the seed of the women in Genesis 3:15?
    11) Who is the seed of Satan in genesis 3:15?
    12) Why did God call Jesus the first born of all creation?
    13) How are God, and Jesus one?
    14) Why did Judas betray Jesus?

    These 14 questions will answer, “Did Jesus die for our sins.“ How many of these 14 questions can you answer?

    • Peter K. (admin)

      My answers

      1) Was Jesus a perfect man without sin? yes
      2) If he had not been murdered, would he have never died? yes
      3) Did Jesus came to die to free us from our sins? Yes, in the sense that He died a Ransom (corresponding price) for Adam’s descendant’s a right to life.
      4) Was he a sacrifice? or is there more to his death? a sacrifice / ransom / anitlutron/ corresponding price
      5) Jesus is said to have been dead for three days…was he? For parts of three days
      6) Why did the Romans thrust a spear into him, and not the other two men with him? To see if Jesus was dead and whether they needed to break his legs / to fulfill prophecy
      7) Could Jesus have had children? Yes, but His missing was to die and become a Ransom for ALL.
      8) Why did Jesus come to die when he did, and where he did? Jesus’ came to die to save mankind, to Israel, to give His people an opportunity to accept the Messiah.
      9) Is this the seed God spoke of in Genesis 3:15? Yes, also the seed of Abrahm. Galaltions 3 explains that Christ is that seed and expands it to His body members.
      10) Who is the seed of the women in Genesis 3:15? Jesus is the seed of the woman, by extension His body members (Romans 16:20)
      11) Who is the seed of Satan in genesis 3:15? Satan is the God of this world. His seed is his followers and body member. Jesus says Satan can’t cast out Satan unless he is divided. Just like Christ has body members, so does Satan – his seed.
      12) Why did God call Jesus the first born of all creation? Jesus was God’s first creation and highest ranking creation.
      13) How are God, and Jesus one? In spirt, mind, unity, just as we should be one with Jesus.
      14) Why did Judas betray Jesus? Do you mean, was Judas motive. We don’t know for sure. Perhaps to force Jesus hand in defeating the Romans and setting up the kingdom. Judas betrayal was in fulfillment of prophecy and a step to bring Jesus to crucifixion.

      • Domenic Pappalardo

        Thank you Peter.

        When I chose these 14 questions, they were based on what I believe can be proven. It is not to say your answers are incorrect.

        14. My thinking on Judas is as you stated. I too do not think Judas was doing a bad thing. I also believe he was trying to put Jesus in a position to kill the Romans. His action does show he believed Jesus was the son of God.

        3. Many people believe Jesus died for our sins. On this I differ. I’m sure all Christians will agree, Jesus died to remove the sin inherited from Adam, and Eve…but that is only one sin. This is my thinking on this question; If Jesus died for our sins, meaning all of our sins, that would mean anything we do wrong is already paid for. We would have no need to request forgiveness from the father, or would we have to stand in judgments of our sins…again this is just my reasoning. Jesus died for Just one sin.

        5,and 6. these two questions are married one to the other. You are correct he was dead for parts of three days. The Jews would always count a half day as a full day…thus Jesus was counted as dead for three days. Not many people know that. The sun was starting to go down, which would mark the start of the Passover. Under Jewish law, those being executed could not be left on the stake/cross during the Passover. It would seem Jesus was still alive, and had to be put to death. The breaking of his legs was put aside for fear he would not have died by sunset, thus he was speared in his side.

        Questions 4, 8, 9, 10, 11. You and I have crossed roads on these questions. We both know in this field our thinking is very different. I hope some day we can sit down face to face, and let the Bible answer these questions.

        I agree with 1, 2, 7, 12, 13.

  • Bob

    It is a common misconception that Jesus was born in a stable. The angels told the shepherds that they would find a baby wrapped in cloths lying in a manger (Luke 2:12). A manger is defined as “a box or trough in a stable or barn from which horses or cattle eat.” (dictionary.com) In modern times we would find this in a stable, however, in the time of Jesus few people who owned animals were able to afford a stable. Most animals, at that time, were kept inside the house to protect them from thieves and predators. Most houses had an entrance area with the floor covered with straw where the animal was kept and then a few steps led to the living quarters. Some houses were built with a cave behind it where the animal was kept. They would have a manger with food, most likely straw, and water for the animals. Each morning the area would be cleaned and new straw put down. Luke 2:7 says Mary placed him in a manger because there was no room in the inn. The word “inn” in this case is Strong’s #2646 which means “guest chamber”, it is the same word used by Jesus when he told his disciples to arrange the last supper (Luke 22:11). In the parable of the Good Samaritan, Jesus uses a different word to describe a public lodging place. In that case it’s Strong’s #3829 (Luke 10:34). Lodging places in those days were places of ill repute, not a place Joseph would take his young pregnant wife. So Mary placed Jesus in the manger because there was no room for him in the guest chamber of the house where she and Joseph were staying.
    It is also a misconception that as soon as Mary and Joseph arrived in Bethlehem Mary gave birth. Luke 2:6 states, “and so it was, that, while they were there, the days were accomplished that she should be delivered.” From this scripture we see that Joseph and Mary had been in Bethlehem probably for several days. Joseph was of Davidic descent and probably had relatives living in Bethlehem, so most likely he and Mary were staying with relatives as was the custom for travelers at that time. This is speculative, but it seems plausible when we consider all the information. While Jesus’ birth was of humble origins, the tradition handed down through the years that he was born in a stable does not agree with the scriptures, the same as the date of his birth, Dec 25.

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