BACKGROUND
Destruction of the temple
Matt 24:1 Then Jesus went out and departed from the temple, and His disciples came up to show Him the buildings of the temple. 2 And Jesus said to them, “Do you not see all these things? Assuredly, I say to you, not one stone shall be left here upon another, that shall not be thrown down.” NKJV
The background of this Great Prophecy is the destruction of the Jewish Temple.
THREE QUESTION
Matt 24:3 And when he is sitting on the mount of the Olives, the disciples came near to him by himself, saying, `Tell us, when shall these be? and what is the sign of thy presence, and of the full end of the age?’ YLT
Jesus answers all three questions.
1) when shall these be?
In other words, when will the Temple be destroyed? One application relates to the destruction of the Jewish Temple by the Roman armies]
In parts of the Lord’s Great Prophecy, there are two applications, one that applies to the Jewish Harvest and the deeper meaning that applies to the Gospel Harvest. The Luke account has a more direct focus on the Jewish Harvest, which ended with the destruction of the literal temple. More on that later…
2) what is the sign of thy presence? [Parousia]
Although Jesus provides a number of signs of his return in this Great Prophecy, he most directly answers this question in …
Matt 24: 30 “Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven… NKJV
We suggest that this SIGN has two applications:
1) Meat in Due Season – Epiphania / The sign for the Church – The resulting mourning of the tribes of the earth had its beginning with World War 1, which began with the ending of the Times of the Gentiles as taught world wide by Pastor Russell through this meat in due season.
2) The Revealment – Apocalypse / The Sign for the World – When Jesus Second Presence is revealed to the World of Mankind through the miraculous deliverance of Israel as delineated in Ezekiel 38 & 39.
Due to time limitations, the supporting detail for this discussion will have to wait till Part 2 of this discourse.
3) [sign of] and of the full end of the age? [Harvest is the end of the Age – Matt 13]
In the next verses Jesus provides many signs covering a brief history of the Gospel Age, to let his disciples know that it will be a long time before he returns. If there is one major sign of the end of the age it in verse 15 which speaks of seeing the “abomination of desolation… standing in the holy place.” More on this later…
Let’s now review the detail of how Jesus answers this question #3 regarding the sign or signs of the end of the age.
TO READ THE COMPLETE ARTICLE, CLICK HERE TO THE RIGHT: OUR LORDS GREAT PROPHECY SIGNS OF 2ND ADVENT ALSO READ PART TWO BY CLICKING HERE:
I will ask to study with bible students soon. I loved the bible class I just had a lot of problems at time of the study so I had to drop out. Jacqueline you understand some of it. back in few months maybe to one of the study groups.
Said to say it was very hard to say good by to the organization. I had in my mind the master was a lord of freedom because if you want to do right you must go thru trails and abstain from blood means not to murder. I could not tell any one about blood it was wrong to take blood in medical practice because life is in blood with out blood a person dies now I know many transfusion were given just to sell blood. but many people were able to spend more years with grandchildren and family and brothers and sisters of faith and others for more years because of the medical practice of blood transfusion. The Lord YHWH and his son lets us decide our faith soon the 1000 years will start. I rest most Saturdays it does not bother me the many do not rest Saturdays. And I do not do holidays I never was asked or went door to door I was with them for around 23 years of and on going to kingdom hall. never baptized but I had greater faith in kingdom the there governing body. I am the son of Gods servant not the governing body of kingdom halls. The son of Gods blood I take and his word from his Father.
So true. When I left she JWs I cried the rest of the night.
To Jerome;
Those disciples had no knowledge of the book of Revelation. Mat 24:1,”to show him the buildings of the temple.” When did they just come from? verse 1,”Departing now, Jesus was on his way from the temple.” So which temple is visable? And what would happen to this temple? verse 2,”By no means will a stone be left here upon a stone and not be thrown down.” No where in Revelation does it say that is going to happen to New Jerusalem, but the history books say the city of Jerusalem had it happen 37 years later in 70 C.E.
Your logic does not harmonize with the Bible. Could I recommend the book of Nirvanna?
The question asked by his disciples was more far reaching than this. It would make no sense for his disciples to ask about the destruction of the temple and it being associated with his presence and the end.
Jesus’ answer to there question at Matthew 24:30 confirms this.
Matthew 24:3 in full reads:
“As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”
The greater temple would be the one in which he will (and the chosen ones) would be priests and kings within: His Kingdom of 1000 years over the earth. His disciples would be interested in THAT Temple. (Rev 20:6)
What Jesus disciples where asking what this:
“What will be the SIGN of the beginning of your kingdom (his presence or coming as king) and when will that kingdom end?”
They were not asking about the end of THIS world, but the end of his Kingdom after it begins.
Jesus’ yet to come 1000 year kingdom presents another “age” or time period that will exist on the earth. It was the end of that age that they wanted to know about. They would have a vested interest in it.
Besides, the ending of THIS world in which we live today is NOT an ending, it is a BEGINNING of Christ Kingdom that will follow.
Additionally, when Christs kingdom of 1000 years ENDS, it is not the end. Why? Because when his kingdom of 1000 years ends, Satan MUST be released from the Abyss and he has to “establish” a Wild Beast on the earth. (Rev 20:7-8)
Establishing something is not done overnight. It will take a time span to establish his Wild Beast and False Prophet and used them to mislead that future world.
Not only that, Satan, the Wild Beast and False Prophet must be destroyed AND THEN God’s Kingdom comes down.
So, one cannot just state that what is spoken of at Matthew 24:3 is about end of this world. There is a world that is yet to come and it is “definite” it begins and ends: Jesus’ 1000 year Kingdom.
This is what his disciples are asking.
Jesus answer to them at Matthew 24:30 – by giving the sign (not signs) is proof of this. The answer given by Jesus at Matthew 24:30 does not associate “the sign” with THIS world ending. It associates the coming or beginning of Christs kingdom (he comes with power and great glory). It would be to that kingdom’s ending that his disciples where asking.
Too, “the sign” is not “seen on earth” so it is not referring to the world of mankind ending (it will be destroyed before Christ comes). The sign is seen “in heaven.” In other words, only those residing in heaven (the angels and Satan) will witness or see that sign. What is the sign?
Well, since Matthew 24:30 shows Christ “coming” with “power and great glory,” that means he comes as a king. Therefore, the sign or single event seen in heaven will be his Coronation as king.
Jesus Coronation as king does not occur on earth, it occurs where he, his Father, and the angels live: In heaven. That is why Matthew 24:30 say “the sign” appears in heaven.
His disciples who asked him this question at Matthew 24:3 would be interested in “when” his presence (as king) would begin. Why? Because they would be the ones resurrect FIRST as they would be kings and priest with Christ during his 1000 year “definite” kingdom.
Those disciples have been dead now for nearly 2000 years and to this day lie asleep in death until that “sign” appears in heaven (Jesus Coronation as King). When Coronated king, Jesus abysses Satan and begins the FIRST Resurrection in which those disciples who ask the question at Matthew 24:3 will be a part of.(Rev 20:5-6)
Jerome,
Mat 24:3 is a spurious scripture not found in the other two gospels. According to Mark 13:3 there were only four apostles who talked to Jesus privately, “As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives opposite the temple, Peter, James, John and Andrew asked him privately…” Matthew was not one of them. This is a very important question, why didn’t Mark or Luke include it in their gospels? The apostles never believed Jesus would be leaving them, so they could not have asked that question. Cross-reference Luke 24:21, Acts 1:6. Why would they ask him when he was to return if they thought he was “to restore the kingdom of Israel at this time”? Remember Matthew was written in Hebrew and translated into Greek centuries later, after apostate thinking had entered the church. There are many spurious scriptures in the Gospel of Matthew.
Quite frankly, I do not care why Mark and Luke did not include it in “their Gospels.” Mark and Luke do not have “their own” Gospels – this is what men say. God sent only one. (Luke 9:35)
I am aware of ALL of the “spurious” Scriptures. Please understand that I do not view “a book” as The Word of God; I view Christ as The Word of God. I do not view “The Bible” as “Scripture.” I view ONLY the things that God “breathed” or “uttered” as “Scripture. Everything in “The Bible” God did not “breathe” or utter. Jesus’ utterances, as Gods Word, is also Scripture. Examples found at Matthew Chapter 4 where Satan is “breathing” or “speaking.”
I refuse to fall into the trap of what or why Mark or Luke or anyone else said, did not say, include or did not include. They have no Gospels as God did not send these men.
Also, men have had their hands in the creation of a book called “The Bible.” God did not create it. He created a Son of God and He sent him, not a book.
Believe it or not, most of what one will learn of God and His Messiah will not come from a book; it will come from asking God – in prayer through His Son – for His Wisdom, Understanding and Knowledge. It is through His Son – and not a book – that we receive these things from Him.
I am not bound by a book. I go to the source: God Himself, through my Master Jesus [the] Christ.
That is why Jesus said, “Ask you will receive.”
Jerome – What is your authority? How do you know what Truth is? How do you know what God’s will is? I find my answers in His Word, the Bible. If you receive direction directly from God, then get in line. I hear this a lot of that and if I could get you all in the same room to talk, I am pretty sure that you would all disagree with each other. God’s answers need to be tested with scripture to make sure your emotions are not directing your interpretation of God’s leadings in your life. I hope the following will help you. http://www.endtimes-biblereport.com/Past_Issues_files/52HistoryBible_1.pdf
Anonymous – There is lots of information recorded in one Gospel, but not the other two. a verse is not spurious, just because the other Gospel writers didn’t mention it. If all the Gospels were identical, we wouldn’t need three of them.
ce
Why do you say Matthew was written in Hebrew? What evidence do you have?
You say, “he apostles never believed Jesus would be leaving them,” yet Jesus told the disciples he would have to suffer and die and be raised on the third day.
John 14:13 (NASV) says, “”If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am, there you may be also.”
The Olivet Discourse is told in the three gospels of Matthew, Mark and Luke. If you examine the words closely in Mark and Luke, you’ll see that they didn’t say that the Apostles asked about the signs of Jesus’ presence or coming. Notice that there is no mention of a parousia in either of these parallel accounts, or any question about Jesus’ coming! So, if the account in Matthew is right, then Mark and Luke badly misquoted the words of Jesus’ Apostles! Since only four apostles actually asked this of Jesus, it would mean that Matthew was told something completely different than Mark or Luke. This is not a case of different information found in the gospels; we are here referring to the same event related by three different writers. If we believe that the Bible is inspired, as I do, then it should have the same information in all parallel accounts and not be different from one writer to the other.
Also, notice that the words in Matthew don’t make as much sense as what Mark and Luke quoted them as saying! First, why would they have asked about Jesus being PRESENT before he would ARRIVE? Since Jesus had never mentioned such a concept, where would they have gotten that idea? Since Jesus hadn’t mentioned that he would be involved in the destruction of the Temple, why would the Apostles have tied his description of its destruction to his presence or second coming?
There are many instances in the gospels where the apostles didn’t understand that Jesus would leave them. Look up Mark 9: 10, 31-32; Luke 9:44-45; Luke 18: 31-34. In Luke 24: 25-27 Jesus tells them that they were “foolish and slow of heart” because they didn’t understand that the Christ was to die and be resurrected. In Luke 24: 44-45, Jesus had to “open their minds so that they could understand the scriptures”. Does this sound as if they understood what he had told them? The scripture you quoted is from John 14:3 not verse 13, and if you would read to verse 5 you would see that Thomas said to him, “Lord, we don’t know where you are going, so how can we know the way?” Further in John 20:9 “(They still did not understand from Scripture that Jesus had to rise from the dead.)” If the apostles understood that Jesus was to leave them, then why would they ask such a question as found in Acts 1:6? The apostles did not fully understand the teachings of Jesus until after Pentecost.
However, in Matthew 24: 29-31, we do read of the events surrounding Jesus’ actual coming (Ercomi, Strong’s # 2464).
Anonymous,
If you agree the Bible is inspired, I would think you must agree that the disciples asked Jesus what would be the sign of his presence. What I think you are missing is that Jesus was making a double application. The trouble at the end of the Jewish Age (Jewish Harvest and destruction of Jerusalem) typified the trouble at the end of the Gospel Age (Gospel Harvest and destruction of present Heavens and Earth symbolically the Religious and Social order.) The Luke account focuses on the trouble at the end of the Jewish age and the destruction of literal Jerusalem. The Matthew account focuses on what that typified, namely the trouble at the end of the Gospel Age, which is directly related to Jesus second presence. The fact that the disciples were confused before Penticost, does not change the fact that Jesus was giving them information that they would later be able to understand after they received the Holy Spirit. You can find more very helpful information here: http://www.htdb.net/Volume4/V4_12.htm
Just because I agree that the Bible is inspired by God does not mean I don’t believe that spurious verses have been added through the ages by apostate thinking, such as Mat 28: 19, or through translation errors. I’m sure you agree with this as does Br. Russell. This does not mean the Bible is not inspired, it simply means we need to study it and research it, not just read it at face value. I agree that Jesus was making a double application; I just don’t agree that the apostle were aware of it. They had not grasped the idea that Jesus would be leaving them, so why would they ask about his return?
Guys, the future is in our hands.
Let’s all do what we can and expose the Jehovah’s Witnesses’ lies across the Internet through eye-opening blog comments. Not just in anti-JW blogs,, but all over the net. Let’s sow the weed seeds so thick, the damed JWs can’t see where they’re walking. After the organization’s recent humiliations (Sparlock, Candace Conti, selling their Brooklyn property at bargain prices, etc…) this is the perfect time to strike! We can do it!
May the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society rot from the inside!
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Re-post this message somewhere else of you agree that the Jehovah’s Witnesses are a two-faced cult who protects paedophiles.
On a mission! – I don’t feel your comments are very helpful. Jesus said to love your enemies, but you want the WBTS to rot from the inside. True enough there are things to criticize, but do you think the JW Organization is worse than any other Christian denomination? The Papacy killed tens of millions of contrary Christians in the Dark Ages. The pilgrims can to America fleeing the persecution of King James and the Church of England. Today the Churches have many immoral and money hungery ministers. http://marwil-n-llasos.blogspot.com/2009/08/pastors-sexual-immorality-and.html Brother, if you disagree with the WBTS, then reach out with reason, scripture and with love. Don’t try to crush them, try to win them over.
Hi on a mission, I understand your contempt for the society as it is just like the other religions that protect and have a lot of pedophiles in them. Jehovah seems to be exposing them in a large way. One way to help is be there for the brothers when they need a helping hand as Christ expose false religion and mete out discipline. To go after them is like going after the wind only God and Jesus can control the wind. The Catholic Church will not come down by man’s hand and the watchtower society is patterned after them. Don’t let them live rent free in your head. Every person that you help to stabalize after they leave the watchtower that is a victory. This website is to give them a landing spot to see what the Bible really teaches. We encourage you to beat them at their game let Jehovah and Jesus take care of them and forget about them. One tactic is to disfellowship and ruin your family relationship but get some more friends and brothers and sisters as Jesus said that believe in Christ. There is more than one way to skin a cat. Let Jesus do his work and we do ours “Feed His Little Sheep”! they aren’t worth your energy. Take Care on a mission. Hope to hear back from you.