Has the Heavenly Call Ended? Or is it Still Wide Open? Jan 14 WEBCAST

You can now view this webcast by clicking here:

Does the Bible teach that you should be pursuing a earthly hope today, to be a part of the Great Crowd on earth?  Or does it teach that the Christian should be pursuing a heavenly hope, to be a part of the bride of Christ?   On January 14, we recorded our webcast.  Former JW and Bible Student elder David Stein interviewed a panel of Bible students (some Ex-JWs) to investigate and discuss this topic.  They answered the questions– What does the Bible teach about the Little Flock, the Great Crowd, the Other Sheep and the Heavenly Call?  The Webcast was on January 14, 2011 at 7:00 p.m. CST.

61 comments to Has the Heavenly Call Ended? Or is it Still Wide Open? Jan 14 WEBCAST

  • The Real Truth

    The Watchtower Society has Jehovah’s Witnesses criticize other religions and judge them all as controlled by Satan, evil apostates and the like. It needs to direct that baloney at itself. What it calls others is what itself is.

    In contrast I have found the Bible Students to be honest, helpful and healing.

  • Magdalena

    So `amen ` on what Mike says:
    `If you are “in the truth” then please read the four gospels alone and without any WT publications.

    JUST YOU AND THE HOLY SPIRIT .

    Let me know what you learn for the first time. I think you’re going to be very surprised when you find out that YOU are just as deserving as anyone else on this planet to have a personal relationship with Jesus and Jehovah.
    Once I fully read the bible and understood this, my whole life changed and the way I look at the world. May God Bless You and your family.

    And may the Lord bless you Mike .

  • Magdalena

    And His call is out still !
    All who hear His call will come inside ,no door is closed but it is wide open for all who hear God,s voice can come inside.
    Rev22:17The Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” Whoever is thirsty, let him come; and whoever wishes, let him take the free gift of the water of life.

  • Magdalena

    Dear
    You say :”I don’t believe in critizing other religions and calling them false nor do i belive that everyone has to bcome a witness but i urge anyone looking for the right religion to study their bible and pray to God to direct them to the right religion and whatever religion their conscience based on God’s influence directs them is right for them cos jah will not jugde based on religion but the heart condition”
    This is where i believe you are of the path .
    W efirst have to understand the differants between faith or religion.
    Religion is man made
    Faith is holy spirit made .

    Religion is filled with people whose spirit are guided by human leaders
    But Fathr are poeple who are called out of thsi world of religion to become guided by teh holy spirit (to become reborn of the spirit Jesus says .

    19“Sir,” the woman said, “I can see that you are a prophet. 20Our fathers worshiped on this mountain, but you Jews claim that the place where we must worship is in Jerusalem.”

    Jesus says “Believe me, woman, a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem.

    (nor in a organization called Jehovah witness)

    23Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. 24God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth.”

    Jesus said in John5 :37-40 “the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form, nor does his word dwell in you, for you do not believe the one he sent.
    You diligently studyc the Scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life. These are the Scriptures that testify about me,yet you refuse to come to me to have life.

    Dear sister study scripture is not enough !
    For Jesus says inJohn3:5 “I tell you the truth, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water AND THE SPIRIT!

    6Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spiritb gives birth to spirit.
    7You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You must be born again.’
    8The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.

    Jehovah witness make you believe this verse is only for those who they say are “the litlle flock “or 144000.

    But we know Jesus words are for us all ,jew and gentille .
    First the jews for salvation come,s out of the jews Jesus says so in
    John4:22
    But our Brother Paul was apointed to bring the good news to the gentilles .

    Messiah said to the jews “. He calls his own sheep by name and leads them out. 4 When he has brought out all his own, he goes on ahead of them, and his sheep follow him because they know his voice.

    Only few of the jews in Jesus time did hear his call .
    This is why Jesus say next in John10:15,…I lay down my life for the sheep.
    16 I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen.(because they are called out from the gentilles), I must bring them also.

    They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd.

    When the bible is speaking of The litlle flock,it does not point to the anointed coming out of the gentilles ,but this verse is pointing to those few jews who did hear the call first as Messiah was walking on earth ,these few did follow Messiah his voice and accepted him as Yeshua/Jesus Messiah their saviour.
    You can read why in Luke 22:28You are those who have stood by me in my trials. 29And I confer on you a kingdom, just as my Father conferred one on me, 30so that you may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom and sit on thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

  • Anonymous

    I’m a jehovah’s witness and i believe they teach the truth bcos of my personal experiences.I don’t believe in critizing other religions and calling them false nor do i belive that everyone has to bcome a witness but i urge anyone looking for the right religion to study their bible and pray to God to direct them to the right religion and whatever religion their conscience based on God’s influence directs them is right for them cos jah will not jugde based on religion but the heart condition.I’m started my own personal bile study using the King James version.I always tell people that i bcame a witness bcos they gave satisfying answers to my questions and the day they stop doing that is the day i stop being one.Please stop calling yourselves friends of Jehovah’s witnesses cos u’re not,u left cos u were not satisfied.Leave us in peace.You should know better with all your enlightenment after leaving that it is wrong to jugde other religions.You are doing the same thing you accuse the witnesses of doing ” jugding “. So focus on your bible studies and scripture explanations and leaving the jugding to God.

    • Mike

      Dear Anonymous,
      You’re absolutely right about not judging others. Jesus will do that, it’s his job as scripture says. What I believe a lot of ex JW’s are trying to do is get their brothers and sisters to read the Bible on their own, without the society’s influence. I studied with 6 different JW’s. The reason I did that was because I couldn’t believe some of the things that were being taught and told myself that this was just one person. Soon I found out that all JW’s think and teach the same way. Even their answers to my questions were exactly the same. When I would question them on critical issues, their answer was I’ll check with someone at the Kingdom Hall and get back to you the following week. The following week came and no answer. This kept up until they finally said that my pride was getting in the way of me learning. I should have faith in the faithful and discreet slave and it will eventually come to me. Having studied mind control techniques, I immediately recognized what he was trying to do. After constant pressure from me for an answer, he finally stopped the study all together. Amazed that this method was not Christ like, I set up another study with a different witness and got the exact same answers and treatment. Soon I realized that they do not study the bible, they study the watchtower publications. If they were really ” in the truth” they wouldn’t discourage self examination. Every time I wanted to examine scripture,they would always pull out more literature from the WT to convince me of their teaching. Examination of scripture should be done by neutral people like religious scholars, Greek scholars, Hebrew scholars and especially people who have opposite views to consider. I started doing this after 45 years as a Catholic. There are quite a few customs and traditions of the Catholics that aren’t found in the bible. I brought this up to a priest and he was honest with me and admitted that they aren’t all biblical, but they are there to strengthen our relationship with Christ. I told him that things that aren’t in the bible should be optional. He said the most important thing is accepting Jesus as our savior. That’s what saves us, not the human organization that you belong to or the amount of works. They are all filthy rags. My point is, you must be able to question doctrines when they aren’t found in the bible and should be able to do that without being dis fellowshipped. I honestly believe if that fear didn’t exist there would be a lot more questioning of the society. One thing that was constantly told to me during bible study was independent thinking when it comes to the bible is not permitted. That was the first red flag. There are many more. My biggest problem with JW’s is the way they put the organization above Jesus. There is no way you can say otherwise. And I’m fully aware of ” Theocratic Warfare” I believe everyone is entitled to the truth. If you are “in the truth” then please read the four gospels alone and without any WT publications. Just you and the Holy Spirit. Let me know what you learn for the first time. I think you’re going to be very surprised when you find out that YOU are just as deserving as anyone else on this planet to have a personal relationship with Jesus and Jehovah. Once I fully read the bible and understood this, my whole life changed and the way I look at the world. May God Bless You and your family.

  • Steff

    Hello
    An apostate is a person leaving Jehovah. It is not about being or being not in the organisation.
    If you love your God and stick to Him and His Son no one have the right to call you an apostate.
    You can be in the org and being an apostate by obeying to human laws instead of God’s law.
    Don’t give up your searches,
    steff

    • infaliability of Bible

      I fully support your point and quote some beautifful original passages of ‘Dead sea scrolls”in english 4Q381,fr.1
      those original words do,nt point to earthly organization
      ..his wisdom i have declared,and I will meditate on his marvel,and I will become my teacher,Judgement of my mouth and to the simple and they will understand,and to the senselles and they will know,O Lord,how mighty….marvels.He made heaven and earth in his days(?) and by his word..the riverbeds he…..noght and stars and constelations and He caused them to shine……to eat the best of everything and also..in them and all his hosts and his angels to serve man and TO MINISTER TO HIM….we do,nt need a man organizations to serve and LOVE HIS GRACE AND HIS MAJESTY..we do have HIS angels to serve us and to give us worship HIM

  • Anonymous

    You are apostate because you left God’s organization. Brother Russell started the modern day organization but Jah chose to use it. It is not about any one man or men. You didn’t like where the organization was going so you “drew away” therefore becoming an apostate. Everyone has heard of Jehovah’s Witnesses but practically noone has heard of these Bible Students, so who has Jah obviously blessed? This is quite evident by more evidence than could be discussed in this reply. Brother Russell was a beloved brother but there is no way he could run God’s organization from the grave or from heaven. Instead Jehovah’s Will is what took place. He continues to refine his organization even unto this day and will do so until his purpose has been fully accomplished.

    • Peter K. (admin)

      Friend – There was no organization to leave. The early Watchtower, in the days of C.T. Russell was merely a publishing house and lecture service. No Bible Students were forced to take advantage of the lecture service or order the literature; however most of them did so willingly and enthusiastically. C.T. Russell was strongly opposed to organizations and in his book, The New Creation (Volume 6 of Studies in the Scriptures), he explained how according to scriptures, each congregation was to be independent from any controlling body, each consecrated (baptized) member of the congregation being responsible to elect by vote elders qualified by the standards in 1 Tim 3. C.T. Russell warned of the danger of Clergy and Laity, a trap that this new organization fell into (the new organization being the Jehovah’s Witnesses).

      Your arguments for the blessing of Jehovah’s organization are very similar to the arguments the Papacy used in the dark ages when we so called heretics were severely punished (unless we would recant, then perhaps the punishment would be lesser in degree).

      You say about Brother Russell “there is no way he could run God’s organization from the grave or from heaven.” He never did run Jehovah’s organization, because he never controlled the Bible Students and Jehovah never had a Christian organization on earth. Our relationship with Jehovah is a personal relationship through his son Jesus Christ (John 14:6)

      Please present the scriptural evidence to demonstrate that God has a Christian organization on earth. (I hope you don’t use the same arguments as the Papacy, but even so we should consider any scriptural evidence.)

  • GhostriderXII

    First of all, my nick is my nick, don’t try to read anything into it.
    Second, you admit to being apostate, nuff said.

    • Peter K. (admin)

      Nick – How can we be apostates if we never left our beliefs? We held faithfully to them, even as Joseph Rutherford changed them. By the strict dictionary definition of apostate, wouldn’t Joseph Rutherford be an apostate? He purposely worked against C.T. Russell’s clear instructions in his will. There was to be no president to replace CT Russell, but instead an editorial committee of five to decide by vote on the material in the Watchtower. Russell spelled out which brothers this editorial committee would be composed of. Rutherford fought against these brothers and imposed his own autocratic rule. He insisted on many doctrinal changes. Up to that time, there was no person or body governing the Bible Students (who had been enjoying the Watchtower publications). Bible Students continue to promote C.T. Russell’s original Studies in the Scriptures and the early Watchtower publications. Therefore, how can you justify calling us apostates?

      P.S. Do you like any of the recent super hero movies that have come out?

  • GhostriderXII

    I don’t know anyone who after leaving their religion makes it a point to take as many with them as possible. Oh wait!, YES I do. He is called Satan and his deamons….

    • Peter K. (admin)

      GhostriderX12 – If your name is a reference to the Marvel occult hero, personally I prefer the more sanitized classic heroes from the 1960s like Spider-man and the Fantastic Four. I agree that Jehovah gave us an imagination, so these fictional heroes can be lots of fun.

      We are the children of the original Bible Students, from the original early Watchtower. Perhaps you saw us in the recent JW movie, Faith in Action. We did not leave our original beliefs, i.e. the Ransom for ALL, the heavenly call, etc. Joseph Rutherford changed the doctrines and disfellowshipped many of us. He renamed the group to Jehovah’s Witnesses later, when there were very few of the original Bible Students left. So today’s JWs have left the original Watchtower. Today’s Bible Students still promote the Studies in the Scriptures series that you saw in your movie.

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